#14:45:
Moo started an outsourcing company right after college, doing application development for overseas companies. One of the apps they worked on was a digital magazine for the then newly-launched iPad. So he pulled 5 people from the existing company and started Ookbee. 7 months later, they were profitable.

#14:50: In Ookbee’s first month after launch, their revenue was as low as several hundred USD. But the improvements accrued. Moo attributes part of the success to the business model – Ookbee’s revenue sharing deals with publishers brings good content in (publishers get to keep 70%, with little to no extra cost). In Thailand, that got all the big media hosues on board. The magazines themselves, then, gave the company free advertising…creating a snowball effect. Ookbee is now 40 people, 3 million users, about 10% of them paying. Last year, they made $3 million, with a slim $3-400,000 profit.

#14:56: Ookbee raised $2 million last year to focus on growth. Being one of the first Thai companies in this space, revenue had to be found right away to convince investors that this was worth doing. They’re now trying to expand outside of the country – with small offices in Malaysia, Vietnam and Singapore (NOTE: They’re still looking for partners in Indonesia). Right now, they want to build “local knowledge” and lay low, before expanding aggressively.

#15:00: Thai entrepreneurs are “good, technical folks” but inexperienced. The problem is thinking out of the box to generate revenue streams – too many have the ideas, Moo says, but just talk vaguely about an “advertising model” when pressed on revenue generation. “Outsourcing is the easiest way to make money in this region,” he says. “But without your own projects you can never take off.”

Ookbee is looking for other products to sell to the same audience they’ve captured through Ookbee. Audio Books are in the pipeline (they’ve just finished constructing a recording room). “There are several more projects like that,” he says enigmatically.

#15:03: Buyers are interested in Ookbee, but Moo is isn’t telling us more. “Around 4″, he says in response to a question on just how many companies are interested in Ookbee. Moo says the exit option is there, but the chance to “take our service to the next level” takes priority.

“Bangkok’s Most Eligible Bachelor” then exits to applause, stage-left.

This is a part of our coverage of Startup Asia Singapore 2013, our event running on April 4 and 5. For all our newest Startup Arena pitches, see here. You can follow along on Twitter at @techinasia, and on our Facebook page.

Summary

PO founder Willis Wee spoke with Sold.sg co-founders Angeline Tham and Tian Qiuyan about their penny auction business, which now has over 80,000 users and is making a profit. They spoke about issues with the penny auction model, plans to expand into other areas of Asia (they’ve just established a branch in Malaysia), and what it’s like to be a female entrepreneur.

For the full story, check out the live blog transcript below.

Liveblog

#14:27: And that’s it for this session, the last session at Startups in Asia (Singapore) 2012! Now on to Startup Arena!

#14:25: What are your three tips for female entrepreneurs? (1) Be confident. (Qiuyan). That’s it. “I don’t think there’s anything specifically for females,” says Angeline. “Be decisive [...] don’t be afraid to take risks,” adds Qiuyan.

#14:25: “So far we’ve not really faced any gender discrimination,” says Angeline.

#14:23: Do you face any difficulties as female entrepreneurs? Not really. ‘Actually, it has helped us.’

#14:21: Just recently launched a version in Malaysia. Where else do they plan to expand? “We definitely have plans to expand in the region,” says Angeline, and they also have plans to expand to new models, since “we know that this model is not for everyone.” But both ladies are coy and won’t say anything specific about their plans. They will admit it’s in the area of e-commerce, and categorized as B2C.

#14:20: Willis has determined both Qiuyan and Angeline are single, and is attempting to find them some dates amongst our audience of single entrepreneurs.

#14:18: This founder team is two friends and one brother, but Willis says we hear advice about not running businesses with friends and family. What are the pros and cons of doing it? Qiuyan says one “pro” is trust. You know you can trust family and close friends. Also, knowing each other helps with management. Cons: “We see each other too much.”

#14:17: Lots of failed competitors. Why? Qiuyan: “There’s a lot of work that goes on behind the scenes that people don’t see.” Operations (they sell about 40 different items per day), customer service and education, IT issues. “It takes a lot more work than what people see.” Competitors fail to realize that.

#14:15: How do you prevent scams and frustration? They do their best to educate users about the model, and advise users not to use the site until they understand the model. But “we deliver on whatever we’ve stated on the site,” says Angeline. ‘If it was a scam, we wouldn’t have our names, addresses, and faces on the site.’

#14:14: In total, the site has around 80,000 users and is making a profit. Angeline says the profit margin is around 10 percent. They also recent received a cool million (dollars) in funding from various angel investors.

#14:13: So why the penny auction model? “We learned about the idea [and] thought it would do really well here [in Singapore],” says Angeline. “It’s something that we’re passionate about.” But they do more than just penny auction, and are looking at other models for potential expansion.

#14:10: “The salary is [...] definitely a huge thing to let go of, prestige is another,” says Qiuyan. Being a banker can become part of who you are, apparently, which makes it harder to leave, so letting go was difficult. But ultimately she decided it wasn’t worth it. It’s better to have a good team and work with trusted partners.

#14:08: You can make a lot of money in banking. Was there fear in moving to a risky startup? “Definitely.” Angeline says it helped for them in that they didn’t need to support their families financially. But at the end of the day, what’s important is what you enjoy.

#14:06: So why did they choose to leave banking and do a startup? “Banking is…bureaucratic.” In a startup, “we can choose our own fate,” says Qiuyan. “In banking you work like a dog,” says Angeline, and they didn’t feel fulfilled.

#14:01: Sold.sg is a pay-to-bid site. Users purchase tokens to participate in auctions. It’s a “penny-auction site.” Is it a scam, asks Willis? No. “We don’t believe in manipulating auctions,” says Angeline.

#14:01: This coffee chat is with Angeline Tham and Tian Qiuyan, the co-founders of Sold.sg.

Willis spoke with Anuj Khanna Sohum, the founder and chairman of Affle Group, on day two of Startups in Asia in Singapore. Our live blog from the talk follows below.

Liveblog

#12:23: If you are committed to your venture, jump! Get in there!

#12:19: For me there are some fundamental things I do for any new thing. I ask myself, am I fully committed — both to myself and to team members or partners. Putting in solid time and money behind it. If you don’t do that, you are reducing chances of success. Build a good team for yourself. It’s an invaluable asset that will see you through. Be careful you you choose, because there are risks, but it is important. Also, don’t be too in love with you idea. Adapt, be ready to chance. Evolve, because your ideas will look very different when you are successful.

#12:16: How committed to you to your own venture? How much money have you put in. If you’re a student and its $5000, that’s commitment. But if you have a full time job, and [the venture is secondary], then that’s not commitment. Finding strategic investment is not difficult. If you can find justification to do a project with you or back it up with investment, but please do avoid the pitfalls of giving over control. Negotiate higher valuations, don’t give over board seats and you should be fine.

#12:14: By definition an investor wants to invest, make money, and get out. If an entrepreneur thinks that way, I’m not sure they are being true to their idea. But they do, of course, need to deliver a return. An entrepreneurs role is greater than getting an exit. Be honest to your overall vision and purpose, but don’t take on different roles after every single meeting that you go to.

#12:13: I don’t think about exits as much as convention wisdom says you should. If you build a good business with a profitable model, then the exits will come. To me an exit is a side effect of a good business, not the other way around.

#12:12: I think even now VCs in Asia don’t give high valuations. In the absense of a fair VC-based ecosystem, strategic investors are [a good option]. There are a lot of pitfalls if you get a strategic investor though, if you don’t manage the contract carefully. We at Affle did not give any board seats to strategic investors. We have a very credible board. We really raised the bar and managed it really tightly, going the strategic investors way. I’m not saying you shouldn’t go the VC way, but there are fewer startups qualified for funding, and more VCs out there — so the odds are in favor of the entrepreneur. So just make sure you get a fair valuation. You are at [worst] equals, if not in a commanding position.

#12:07: Microsoft came in and invested at end of 2008. You remember the Lehman crash at that time, everyone was cautious then. We closed the deal around December at 2008. We did that deal with Redmond, and it was quite a big deal. Bill Gates was replaced by Ray Ozzie, and this went all the way up to the top. To speak with him was a pretty big meeting for us. Times of India was one of the first investors we got back in 2007, they are a media company in India.

#12:04: I’ve always believed that there is lots of money around, but there are few few good entrepreneurs to take it. I’ve always believed that money is not the constraint.

#12:01: RE D2C, (D2 means a joint venture between Docomo, Dentsu, one of the largest carriers and one of largest ad agencies). I met the CEO at a conference in China, and we found we had a common vision.

#12:00: Five years into doing Affle, I would still say it is a startup.

#12:00: If you look at startups in Singapore, you’ll find many foreign scholars trying to do things here.

Summary

James Tong (pictured above), who hails from Singapore, is the founder and president of Asia operations at Dextrys. He’s on the board of iDA, and is also a venture partner at Gobi Partners, which is a SG$100 million fund that focuses on Southeast Asian startups that have promise in the Chinese market.

This morning he’s chatting to our Willis Wee about moving into the China market…

Liveblog

#11:57: And that’s a wrap. Startups who might like to turn to iDA for guidance should start on its website.

#11:55: Now, in 2012, should startups move to Silicon Valley or China? Depends on your area, says James. If your idea is social networking, then go perhaps to the US, where that’s unrestricted. But if it’s, say, e-commerce, then go to where the consumers are, in China. But it also depends on your comfort zone.

How about an IPO for Dextrys? James suggests now’s not the right time, especially for a Chinese tech firm, which tend to be viewed with suspicion these days. But he’s aiming to list in maybe two or three years time.

#11:53: “Commitment is important. You have to go there [to China].” That’s his advice for startups. Plus, young teams going to China need to meet locals – not just other expats – and talk to them. Get to know the industry. Don’t be ashamed to ask for help from agencies. Either the iDA offices in Shanghai or Singapore, or any other government agency. Help is there, says James.

#11:50: James jokes that how much alcohol you can drink is crucial to success in China. That’ll be the baijiu then. And KTV (karaoke) girls, jokes Willis? But James says that government relations in China is actually quite straightforward, involving speeches, meetings, and – yes – a lot of alcohol. But not KTV girls.

How about bribery? Well, says James, startups and other firms are in a monied and stable industry where that doesn’t happen.

#11:48: Dextrys has gotten support from the Chinese government, which is a rare thing. But James insists it’s not so unusual – the Chinese government backs startups just as the Singaporean one does. How much exactly? James says the city of Suzhou gave his firm US$1 million a while back, and also waives some rent. “Holy shit,” says our ever-eloquent Willis.

#11:47: Suzsoft soon grew and bought a US firm called Darwin. That required a new name – Dextrys – to avoid a hyphenated brand that’d sound like a firm of lawyers, says James.

US$105 million in revenue in 2011 – that’s the main Dextrys stat from its IT solutions business.

#11:45: Why Suzhou, and not nearby Shanghai, asks PO’s Willis? Well, Suzhou is one of the very many Chinese cities which have a population greater than Singapore itself. That’s a lot of growth potential. Plus, a smaller city could be a good, different strategy to be the biggest fish in a smaller pond before moving to a larger body of water.

#11:44: After that three-year period, he started his own company, an IT solutions firm called Suzsoft, which is based in Suzhou, where James now lives.

#11:42: Then in China, James became a VC, doing that role for three years. That job involved moving a lot of startups from the US to Asia, as they lacked a revenue model in their native countries. One of those companies he backed really took off, and eventually moved back to focusing on the US, and went to IPO.

#11:39: His second company was IG when he was still in the US. Before closing his first, he returned the money to the investors, rather than burning through it. That second company didn’t yield too much of n exit profit, he concedes. After all that, he moved to mainland China. “In 2001, Silicon Valley was depressing … A whole bunch of ex-millionaires there. Then China seemed like the next boom.”

#11:36: Why move to the US? James explained that the US was the only tech arena in the 90s, in contrast to the strength of the entrepreneurial scene in Asia these days.

#11:34: James left Singapore in his 20s and went to work in the US, and then in the 1990s started his first company. He admits his first attempt was a failure in Silicon Valley, but that’s how thing goes, and the startup scene actually embraces failures

#11:33: James and Willis are now sat on stage, with the ubiquitous mug of coffee.

Summary

Willis chatted with Steven Goh, the CEO and co-founder of mig33. The following is our live blog of their talk.

Liveblog

#10:45: If you do go down the venture route, you do need to think about what your exit looks like. You want to have a commitment to try to make that happen. But it really comes down to what do you want to do as an entrepreneur.

#10:44: [What is your exit plan?] We’re going to start by being fabulous. (laughs) For me personally, I’m only interested in building a company that I can IPO, though if something else happens along the way, that’s great.

#10:42: Forget about anything that looks like a Paypal [for online payments] in Indonesia. When you looks at digital advertising, I think last year it was 40 million and this year 50 million — that’s just too small.

#10:38: More than half of our daily active users are in Indonesia. Indonesia looks like bizarro China more than any other market. It’s flooded with Chinese handsets, low-cost Android handsets. It is a different market.

#10:36: So much of social networking is about conversational tools, even in your game experiences. You can’t have social games running in isolation. This is about making mig33 contemporary.

#10:35: We’re trying to build a better Weibo. We got one million daily actives, which is great.

#10:34: For a while we were very successful in chat, a parallel to the Tencent model. We’ve launched our mini blog and are building around that.

#10:32: Larger Asia is going to look like versions of China. Indonesia in particular. These markets are very successful in their own rights. When it comes to collection payments, stop looking elsewhere — your solutions are in your backyard.

#10:30: Steven talks about payment collection for virtual goods in developing markets, mentioned the “Amway model.”

#10:27: Raising money is only half the transaction. The exit is the other half. Ultimately raising is hard enough. Exiting is much much harder.

#10:24: Advice for entrepreneur: If you go the venture route, you want a minimal viable product, can show you have a product that people love which can scale — ideally one that can be viral. You need to show there is value in venture — that if a VC invests in you that you can accelerate and deliver return. If that’s not what you think is in the mix, there are other options, and that’s not a negative thing.

#10:19: Stephen says launched mig33 2003, went to Silicon Valley and two years (and three month) ago moved it back to Singapore. Says there is an ambient, experimental environment in Silicon Valley, ecosystem there is great — from angel funding to series A. That works well for SV. In Asia you have to remove the assumption that there is digital advertising industry here, because there isn’t.

This post is a part of our coverage of Startups in Asia (Singapore), Penn Olson’s first tech conference. Our full coverage of the event can be found here, for our RSS feed, click here.

Summary

Tetsuya Mori (pictured above on the left), managing director at DeNA Asia (and ex-VC at Mitsubishi UFJ Capital) joins us to give us his insights on the social gaming market in Southeast Asia. He’s based here in Singapore, not his native Japan, leading his company’s outreach across the continent.

Liveblog

#13:55: And after some closing quips, the coffee chat is over. Thank you, Mori San! (Next up is a love-blog of DeNA’s equally giant rival, GREE).

#13:53: “You can make a million dollars per month,” says Mori. Wow, I’m in the wrong job…

#13:49: “Games speak a lot,” Mori notes, and so a great game is key. “Excellent artwork is very important,” he says, and so he looks for those qualities in the many great game devs he meets in SE Asia, and he then wants them help to come to (aka: launch in) Japan and make money from their title.

But it’s not so easy. Even what’s considered cute – kawaiiiiiiiiii – differs across countries. It’s 80 percent different, that perception, between Japan and Indonesia, he says by way of example. Thinking of Moe, the anime character that’s so popular in Japan, Mori says that game developers should make characters as cute as Moe so as to capture the imaginations of Japanese gamers.

#13:47: Does Mori do any personal angel investing? “It’s a difficult business,” he says, which is not just about the return, but also “your own willingness to help.” But, alas, he says he doesn’t personally invest.

#13:42: GREE. The elephant in the room. It’s DeNA’s major rival (and the next coffee chat guest at 2pm) which has also set up an office in Singapore. Mori admits they’re very similar. Plus, it has GREE Ventures, which is treading on DeNA’s toes by hooking up some great gaming startups.

How about the ongoing GREE vs DeNA lawsuit? Mori says he was surprised to see the news of that, and then chuckles. “What we do is entertaining people, so this is entertainment too. It’s a game.” Oh well, it’ll pan out in the end.

#13:40: Who, asks PO’s Willis, is DeNA actually working with in Thailand? “Well, we have many friends,” says Mori. “And now we’re going through multiple channels” and looking at some developers, but he can’t elaborate further right now.

Korea is still a major focus, where online gamers are more numerous – and, I should point out, wealthier as well.

#13:38: Turning to Thailand, Mr. Mori says that the users there are a bit more mature in terms of being prepared to spend money online. Also, startups in Thailand are blossoming.

#13:36: Vietnam is awesome! That’s the gist of what’s being said – they know how to scale, and have great developers who’re passionate about games. “And the pho noodles are great,” jokes Mori. That’s why the Japanese firm has been looking so closely at the emerging Vietnam. But not just that country. Its mobile gaming platform Mobage is spreading across Asia, being launched in new nations. Plus, a backup for its data centres is a concern – SE Asia would be a safe backup, especially after the massive earthquake last year. “SE Asia is a great place to be.”

#13:28: “We’re sowing the seeds for the future,” says Mr. Mori, because social gaming is so huge and still growing. It’s so lucrative and profitable for developers, DeNA is encouraging more devs to get into this.

#13:30: Southeast Asia is a huge focus for DeNA. But first, says Mr. Mori, talent is key. Developing is not hard in itself, he notes, but it can be tough to get all the people on board. That’s why DeNA has been looking at Vietnam, where they’ve made some strategic investments and partnerships.

#13:32: After acquiring Punch Entertainment a while back, do DeNA plan to buy any more? But Tetsuya demurs. So that’s top secret, then. But he admits they’re “scanning Thailand, Malaysia … India” and lots more places. Willis gets Mr. Mori to say that they’re keen to acquire if the price is right.

General Summary
Willis Wee spoke with James Tan, the co-Founder of 55tuan who we have written about before and managing partner at QuestVC. James discussed his own experiences going to China to do business there, and explained that while his experience there has been a fruitful one so far, that it can often be an arduous process for foreign startups to adjust to the market there.

Liveblog

#10:09: Typically we want to invest in local startups, because for foreign startups to come into China and learn the local system, local markets — it can take as long as three years, and that’s just too long.

#10:07: If your idea is something we think makes sense for Chinese market, we would be happy to help you do everything along the way. But at the same time we don’t want to make it too comfortable.

#10:06: On China besides Beijing: You can explore, but its still pretty much about Beijing for me. That’s where companies can find the necessary talent. The country can support many hubs, but there is still one major center and that’s Beijing.

#10:04: James refers to how many companies in China “copy first and innovate later.” If you look at all the big startups in China. Baidu, like Google. Tencent like MSN and ICQ. All of them started as copied but differe greatly from the originals now. It means localizing and innovating on top of the initial idea.

#10:01: I’m not going to defend [Chinese copying], but if a good idea comes from the west, it will be copied anywhere in the world. Executing well is important, because even if you copy, it may not work if it is not executed well.

#10:00: Advice to entrepreneurs: Find good partners. I think events like this help, I would love to see Penn Olson do an event like this in Beijing.

#09:59: There is a crisis of trust in Chinese companies that started back in May or June. We took a step back to look at the best time to list. We had to step back and ask, do we need capital or not.

#09:58: There are many ranking criteria. We typically go by revenue, which see us in the top three. Top three players are always consistent. There are only three sites that have a transaction value of 200 million RMB. Every day we transact more than $1 million.

#09:57: Three months after launch we had about 80 competitors.

#09:56: James explains how he went to China on a scholarship, met cofounders there. Cofounders all from Qinghua university.

#09:53: 55tuan is one of China’s largest ecommerce site. But the model has changed much since it started.

This post is a part of our coverage of Startups in Asia (Singapore), Penn Olson’s first tech conference. Our full coverage of the event can be found here, for our RSS feed, click here.

Summary

Dr. Lim Kuo-yi, CEO at Infocomm Investment (IIPL), tuned into his experience to assess if it’s too easy to get VC funding in Singapore, and explained what the government-backed funding agencies are looking for. Please read the full time-line to follow the chat…

Liveblog

#09:50: That’s it, folks. Thanks for tuning in. Next up is James Tan, who owns one of China’s top group-buy sites, 55Tuan.

#09:47: Lim says he’s excited about Game Ventures, a social gaming company, but won’t be drawn on saying which startups they’re thinking of investing. Hey, with 19 startups in line for our Startup Arena prize, one of those could even be presenting later this afternoon.

#09:44: Not enough graduates are coming out, says Dr. Lim, so that makes hiring difficult. The national army draft for two years also really complicates the issue. So companies and small startups need to be careful, aware that they can’t just put an ad in a newspaper to find talent.

#09:43: Are Singaporean uncreative? “No, we can be creative,” says Lim, with lots of musicians, artists, startup people, etc. That’s a reference to the criticism from Steve Wozniak, Apple co-founder, who says that the city state citizens lacked originality. So that’s debunked then.

#09:42: Dr. Lim says there’s a good amount of self-awareness in the local government about what’s right to invest in. If mistakes happen and money goes down the drain, lessons are actually learnt.

#09:39: “The Singapore government is very clinical in the investments it wants to see,” says Dr. Lim, and the various agencies tend to specialize in what they’ll invest in. If a startup goes to the wrong agency, they’ll be guided to one that matches their area.

So, asks Willis, are we actually making it all too easy? Lim says no. Indeed, it’s getting harder now, “and it’s getting more deliberate in how funds are going out” to startups.

#09:38: A friendly reminder. Please refresh the page manually in your browser to see the conversation flow!

#09:35: Lim then goes on to talk about how some startups just come up with an idea just to get some money out of it, without being truly passionate about it. So he says experience is key to getting into the right entrepreneurial mindset. And so in those situations, he says “give the startups 50k [US$50,000]” and let them get the experience themselves. Our own Willis loves this idea.

#09:33: So how many startups have IIPL actually funded? The answer is nine. Dr. Lim emphasizes that his firm helps people to come to SG, but does also invest in some young firms.

#09:31: Some hardcore numbers? Lim says there are 3,000 to 4,000 companies with whom IIPL is in close contact, and then 30 to 40 of them indeed choose to come to Singapore to be based.

#09:29: What is IIPL’s key performance indicator, asks Willis. Dr. Lim says that it’s about helping startups set up an engineering team in Singapore, as they’re focused on engineering firms.

#09:28: “We’re getting companies to look at Singapore,” says Dr. Lim. He has been on the Singapore entrepreneur scene for 10 years.

#09:26: IIPL is funded by the government, through the IBA state program, points out Dr. Lim.

#09:23: If you’d like to follow along with chatter about this event, the Twitter hashtag is #startupasia.

#09:01: The first ever ‘coffee chat’ session at the inaugural Startups in Asia event gets under way at 9:30am Singaporean time. PO’s Willis Wee is chatting with Dr. Lim Kuo-yi, CEO at Infocomm Investment (IIPL) about the entrepreneurial scene here in sunny Singapore…

During our two-day Startups in Asia (Singapore) event on February 2nd and 3rd, we have an amazing group of industry players lined up for our ‘coffee talk’ series. Over the past few weeks we’ve given you occasional previews of what you can expect to hear during our event, which kicks off tomorrow morning.

For those of you who may have missed our previews, here’s the coffee chat lineup once again, along with our short previews. For those attending the event, we’ve provided some calendar options below with specific times provided, so you can keep track of what’s happening throughout our two-day event.

Day 1, Thursday

• Lim Kuo-yi, CEO at Infocomm Investment – Are Entrepreneurs in Singapore Over-Reliant on Government Grants?
• James Tan, Co-Founder of 55tuan; Managing Partner at QuestVC – Co-founder of 55Tuan To Discuss China and Entrepreneurship at Startup Asia Singapore
• Dr. Serkan Toto, Independent Consultant, Japan Correspondent For TechCrunch – Southeast Asia and Japan Through a German’s Lens
• Lux Anantharaman, co-founder and CEO of iTwin – Building a Hardware Startup in Singapore
• Tetsuya Mori, Managing Director at DeNA Asia; Ex-VC at Mitsubishi UFJ Capital – Social Gaming Startups in Southeast Asia
• Tatsuo Tsutsumi Director of GREE Ventures Investment Office and Noritaka Kobayashi, Head of APAC business Development at GREE – What is GREE Doing in Southeast Asia?

Day 2, Friday

• Arvind Rajan, Managing Director and VP, APAC and Japan – Running LinkedIn Singapore Like A Startup
• Steven Goh, CEO and Co-founder, mig33 – Raising Capital, Generating Revenue, and the God Damn Exits
• James Tong, President Asia Ops, Dextrys & Venture Partner, Gobi Partners – From Singapore, Silicon Valley, and then to China
• Anuj Khanna Sohum, Founder and Chairman, Affle Group – Raising Funds From Strategic Partners

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